Talk:Argent Dawn

Recent Edit
I just edited and rearranged a few slabs of article text, so I thought I'd better post what and why. Having had to use this article for the first time recently, it struck me that the article didn't flow very well, and that some sections were well below Wowwiki standard, with haphazard repetition of facts, and frequently very casual/colloquial/lazy wording and grammar. It's obvious that there have been many additions over time without much regard to the overall flow of the article. I've attempted to reorganize and reword a little, but it's really only scratching the surface. A few notes: -- w.woods (talk) 06:40, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I cut the introduction back to one paragraph. Originally it had a 3-paragraph intro, which seemed to be a smaller version of the entire article and stated many facts that were repeated later under their correct sections, things that were not appropriate for an intro.
 * Any info that I cut from the intro - that wasn't mentioned later - was moved to its proper section. No actual information was lost, just the repetition of it.
 * There are unreferenced statements littered through the article that strike me as pure contributor speculation, but I don't know enough to delete them. Some of them I "blunted" a little, however.... sometimes weasel-words are better than risking deleting :)

Cauldron Quest
I just did the one at Dalson's Tear to fill in how much points you get to do this quest. However, I noticed that one chain dissapeared once I turned it in. What happens if you have enough to turn in the quest 4 times directly? (The cauldron is on the ground by 4 chains) --Ragowit 13:10, 4 Jul 2005 (EDT)
 * Nothing happends.. only one chain dissapears, and that's it. --Ragowit 14:38, 4 Jul 2005 (EDT)

1.12 Drums of War patch
With the new patch, while in EPL, you can get a %increase in the turn in values for Argent Dawn Valor Tokens. If your side (Alliance or Horde) has control of the towers, the zone-wide effect of Echoes of Lordaeron will add to your turn in rep. Instead of 25 rep per token I was getting 27 or 28 (rounding error ?). So save up the tokens and wait till your side is winning before turning in.
 * You're getting the Human diplomacy bonus of 10%, which turns 25 rep into 27.5

Things to do
Patch 1.11 develops the Argent Dawn adds plenty of Argent Dawn backstory into the game -- we should tidy up Argent Dawn and related pages for aesthetic value and lore content: Brotherhood of the Light probably deserves a page as well, depending on the scope of their involvement in future content. As for this page: Anything else worth working on? --Starlightblunder 18:43, 19 June 2006 (EDT)
 * Current abstract is not (just) an abstract. First two sentences are fine, but could be expanded upon.
 * Big section of text starting with "Some say that it is always darkest just before the dawn" and ending in the Table of Contents should go under some header after the ToC. Did we copy that Blizzard? Seems unusually poetic for the rest of this article -- probably need to quote it or rewrite.
 * Split location information to a common section -- Where to find the Argent Dawn? or something long those lines.
 * Article needs some sort of history section -- conversation occuring in Light's Hope Chapel in 1.11 could be the base for that.
 * Rewards section needs updating with new 1.11 items -- and preferably a different layout (tables and such).
 * Added the Insignia rewards and the quests how to get them along with a starter page for Craftsman's Writ. Still need to add in the two Head/Leg resist enchants.  Feel free to comment on the recent changes.--Farlox 02:41, 21 June 2006 (EDT)


 * Very nice, the patch 1.11 information is nearly complete and well done. But, some things I've noticed:
 * The mobs at the necrotic shards that appear during the Scourge Invasion event seem to give 5 reputation per kill even through honored. Maybe the grinding guide needs to be updated? However, I don't know yet until which point they give AD reputation.
 * Concerning the trade skill recipies: I heard you get the new frost resistance recipies at Naxxramas from an NPC there, is this true? If so, this should probably be noted here. --Teomyr 03:21, 24 June 2006 (EDT)
 * The regular invasion mobs (non-elites) stop giving reputation at Revered. Shadows of Doom continue through Revered (probably into Exalted). Trade skill recipies are indeed taught by a NPC in Naxx's death knight wing (there may be multiple ones across the wings -- dunno). --Starlightblunder 04:57, 24 June 2006 (EDT)
 * Doubt there are more trainers, the only items Blizzard listed were the 4 (cloak, glove, wrist, chest), and you get the first 3 at revered and the last at exalted from the deathknight NPC). I haven't seen anything in the other 2 wings (haven't touched abom yet) --Farlox 02:21, 25 June 2006 (EDT)
 * Added that to the page. --Starlightblunder 04:02, 25 June 2006 (EDT)

Resistance enchantments
Ice/shadow enhancements don't require Exalted rep to attain in 1.11. My Priests is Revered and these are available to him.
 * True, and it's actually a Scarlet Crusade NPC that offers them. Can someone check Honored/Friendly? --Starlightblunder 05:18, 23 June 2006 (EDT)
 * I'm also almost positive that you have to turn in Insignia of the Crusade x10, and not valor tokens --Farlox 20:57, 23 June 2006 (EDT)
 * Confirmed, article changed appropriately. This seems a convinient place to keep them for now, but are they even related to Argent Dawn? --Starlightblunder 06:08, 24 June 2006 (EDT)

Craftsman's Writ
Does anyone know whether Craftsman's Writs gives any reputation if you turn in the required items? If so, how much? --Teomyr 10:54, 28 June 2006 (EDT)
 * Never mind, that question is already answered in the article I linked... --Teomyr 11:00, 28 June 2006 (EDT)

Dawn's gambit: Reputation repeatable?
Does anyone know if Dawn's gambit quest gives the full reputation reward EACH time (or only the first time) you return it? If not, I'll hold on to completing it until I hit revered and can no longer get rep by killing standard Elite mobs. If yes, then I'll return it immediately..


 * Like all quests, you only get the bonus rep/exp once. In this case, you can repeat the summoning of the bosses, who give rep and stones everytime, but you don't complete the quest more then once.--Stfrn 23:47, 8 August 2006 (EDT)

Other quests
I don't remember all, but I know there are a more few low-level Argent Dawn quests out there, for example the one you get at the tower in western Desolace. --Shandris 16:09, 29 September 2006 (EDT)

One of the "... of Darrowshire" also gave me 50 AD rep when I turned it into Carlin Redpath. It was either Villians or Heroes. What was odd is that none of the earlier quests in the chain and the next few quests (I have not completed the entire questline yet) later in the chain gave AD rep. --Lindorm, 31 October 2006

Zaeldarr the Outcast gave my 61 Mage 300 AD rep at 8800/12000 Honored, just after patch 2.4. Also got 500 AD rep from the final quest in the Sceptre of Light chain and 700 AD rep from Book of the Ancients at about 7000/12000 Honored a few days earlier. These numbers are without the 10% human Diplomacy bonus -- Crotalidus, 28 March 2008

Reputation in TBC
I've added a section for rep updates in the expansion - please add more values if you know them. I have no characters available lower than Honored at the moment, which limits my ability to test. --Mym 01:27, 19 November 2006 (EST)


 * It seems like they are accelerating reputation processus in beta though, it probably won't stay in live. --Adys 02:47, 19 November 2006 (EST)


 * Repitation has been changed in live patch 2.01 as well, seems like reputation gain does not decay anymore, so you get maximum reputation even for doing gray quests. --Rinchwind, 10 December 2006


 * You get only 1 reputation for lvl 50 and 51 mobs at lvl 60 since the patch. Linkan

Argent Dawn - Pointless slaughter
--Mannerheim 22:50, 29 January 2007 (EST)

The Argent Dawn is pointless, sure it promotes defeating the Scourge, but it actually offers membership to the Forsaken! How can it possibly retake Lordaeron for Humanity if it allies itself with the undead?! Furthermore, it promotes killing Scarlet Crusaders, why would it do that, the people who wage war on the undead everyday? The game makes them seem like the good-guys, but they are really the puppets of the Forsaken. Mannerheim


 * The forsaken aren't neccessarily evil. Their agenda of plagueing humans only extends to the ones in the alliance. Neutral or horde allied(what few exist) humans are not hated by the forsaken. The scarlet crusade on the other hand may slaughter the scourge, by they are also fanatical to the point of killing anyone who disagrees with them, including the agrent dawn. Hope that clarifies. --AnarchyBalsac 08:23, 20 February 2007 (EST)


 * The Argent Dawn doesn't care about getting Lordaeron back to its rightful owners, they only care about destroying the Scourge/Burning Leigon. The Scarlet Crusade would be awesome if they realized how corrupted they are and turned allied with the Alliance. Alas, that probably will never happen and the only ones devoted to restoring Lordaeron would be the humans of Azeroth and the Silver Hand (Tirion vows to reform it). --TM41 22:47, 15 March 2007 (EDT)


 * I hate to disappoint you, but your beloved Forsaken plan to wipe all non-Forsaken with plague. Not only Alliance, but Horde aligned humans and all other races of Horde as well and this is mentioned several times in WoW itself, as well as in other sources. --Rowaasr13 08:11, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Thats what some apothecaries are planning not the Forsaken as a whole. Zarnks 02:33, 3 July 2007 (UTC)


 * It is not "some apothecaries", those are "royal apothecaries", guys working under direct orders of Sylvanas, if you didn't knew. --Rowaasr13 08:37, 3 July 2007 (UTC).

Sylvannas has expresed openly she feels with the blood elves and wants them to survive them in the world. See Lament of the Highborne. And if you wanna talk about unjust genocide what about Kul'tiras,the fact that most people in the Alliance supported their unprovoked attempted genocided on Durotar. The fact that they are still there trying to finish what they started. Zarnks 19:57, 3 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I find it amazing how selective your memory can be. Lament of the Highborne is a lament for all elves, not just blood elves. Not sure how it's relevant here anyway. Neither is the second part relevant, or particularly true. "Unprovoked" is an astonishing word to use when talking about the orcs vs the humans, whilst Kul'tiras is not a true part of the Alliance, need I remind you. 21:06, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

The orc had done nothing wrong, and living peacefully in Kalimdor with the humans. Daelin Proudmoore was trying to kill them all for being orcs and to satisy his petty grudge.

"Lament of the Highborne is a lament for all elves, No its specifically made to lament the fall of Quel'thalas and the citizens that died. The line Sin'dorei makes it pretty obvious it's specific to the blood elves.Zarnks 21:14, 3 July 2007 (UTC)


 * See Lament of the Highborne. Yes, the words have been altered to make it BE specific, but it certainly wasn't created for them. In any case, it has no relevance whatsoever to this. Meanwhile, Daelin was a idiot who did not have the backing of the Alliance - don't generalise from him to the entire population. The Kul Tiras agents currently there are not acting under the orders of the main Alliance. Tiragarde Keep describes the situation better than I can. Anyway, all this is entirely irrelevant to the discussion. :) 21:25, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Actually according to "Although most in the city agree with the forces who attacked Durotar, they do not appreciate the newcomers goading the orcs into attacking their new home. ". But there are plenty of good humans as you pointed out. All races have good and evil members. The only exception is demons but they are just corrrupted former mortals.


 * Coincidentally, I just started rereading Cycle of Hatred - not my favourite WoW book, but still nice to get background. 21:42, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Rep at Unfriendly
I didn't realize that I went to war with Argent Dawn and killed 3 members, which brought me down to Unfriendly. Is there any way I (level 34 Druid) can restore my rep with them, or is it a lost cause. ==Balthasar 09:34, 31 January 2007 (EST)

Just kill some Scourge when you lvl to about 50. Mannerheim

Efficient Grinding
The article mentions, "Therefore Gahrron's Withering is the best place to grind, if you can handle the level 56-58 mobs there." I was wondering if this was necessarily true... grinding Sorrow Hill or Felstone Field will net you bone fragments, which give rep and insignias, too. Furthermore, a level 60 can probably kill twice as many level 50 flayers than the 58's over in Gahrron's Withering in the same amount of time. Given that the rep bonus for the low end items went to 25 from 15, it seems to me that it might be better to grind through Sorrow Hill/Felstone field if your main concern is rep, and especially if you want insignias. Any opinions? Komdori 15:36, 15 February 2007 (EST)


 * Actually those shadowmage areas in eastern plaguelands are better. They're slightly higher level than the garron's withering mobs but they actually give rep until revered(a property which is usually only attributed to elites). Plus they give better scourgestones.--AnarchyBalsac 08:11, 27 February 2007 (EST)

Dark Portal
Does anyone other than me find it odd that the Argent Dawn played a large part in the opening of the Dark Portal event, but have no presence whatsoever in Outland? Byne 08:00, 2 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I do.-- 15:01, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Matbe they think the Alliance and the Horde can handle the Legion themselves and went back to fighting the Scourge again since theyr main goal is to safeguard the world against all evils(and the Scourge is nearer)......and outland isn't tehnecally part of Azeroth so....(Marakanis 01:21, 28 July 2007 (UTC))

Rep gain in patch 2.2
In patch 2.2, Blizzard intends to increase the rep gain for Cenarion Circle, Timbermaw Hold and Argent Dawn. These are my preliminary findings from the first push of patch 2.2 on the PTR, with respect to Argent Dawn.

At revered:
 * Killing some elites in Stratholme: 2 rep
 * Killing some elites in Ruins of Andorhal (eg. tower guards, but not the patchwork horrors): 2 rep
 * Killing some elites in WPL/EPL in general (eg. silver named elite Foulmane): 2 rep
 * Some non-elites around cauldrons (eg. Blighted Zombie, Wailing Death) give: 2 rep
 * Araj the Summoner: 10 rep
 * All three Scourgestone handins: 50 rep
 * Popping a valor token: 100 rep
 * Cauldrons at Felstone Field, Dalson's Tears, The Writhing Haunt, Gahrron's Withering: 50 rep
 * Bone Fragments handin: 20 rep

Lego 14:20, 16 July 2007 (UTC)


 * "Some non-elites around cauldrons (eg. Blighted Zombie, Wailing Death) give: 2 rep". Expanding on this, I've noticed that you get 2 rep for killing the non-elites who give no XP (up from 1). You get 10 rep for killing the ones who give XP (up from 5).
 * The pattern seems to be to double the rep gain, but this would need confirmation. --TheParanoidOne 09:49, 30 September 2007 (UTC)


 * I can confirm that the quests for Insignia of the Dawn/Crusade (i.e. the Bone Fragment handins, etc) now give 1000 rep for the first handin of each type (I'd never done any of them before), and 20 rep for each subsequent hand-in. I'm going to go ahead and edit those two values, but I'll leave the others for other people who can confirm them - I notice that the Scourgestone/Valor Token changes, which I could also have confirmed, have already been made.
 * I'm also pretty sure the 'Superior Armaments of Battle' quest (I wanted the 18-slot bag) also gave 500 rep rather than the listed 250, but I wasn't on the lookout for a change on that quest (it didn't occur to me) so I may be misremembering. I'll leave that for now in case I'm mistaken. SuperfluousC 10:54, 1 October 2007 (UTC)


 * I can confirm double rep for cauldron turn-in quests (got 50 rep for each turn-in, not 25 any longer). I've gone ahead and edited the main page to reflect the new, post-patch reputation gains. Someone please double-check me and make sure I didn't omit anything. --Rmunn 23:46, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Basically I can confirm that all previous reputation gains have doubled. If you get no XP (level greyed) you get now 2 instead of 1 rep. This also applies in Scholomance, as I've recently noticed when playing it at level 68. Level 60 and above mobs yielded 10 rep while lower ones gave 2. Same goes for Stratholme. I edited/added this info accordingly. Also I question the reputation per full run info for Scholo. It might be true if you run it in the level 60 range and gain rep from all mobs. Also I'd like to note Naxxramas data is missing. --SCFREAK 12:24, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

I've found that you can still gain reputation from non-elites after Honored. However, it will (falsely) cap at 5999/6000. If you complete a quest at that moment, you can continue to gain reputation from non-elites. --Ravage 21:17, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't know that it has anything to do with quests... I'm finding that there are certain non-elites that still give rep after Honored. Shadowmages were already known, but I'm also finding that Wailing Death mobs (at Gahrron's Withering) are giving me 10 rep per kill, at 2235/12000 Honored currently. Those are the only rep-giving mobs I've discovered so far, but I'll update if I find more. -- Rmunn 23:10, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

In addition to Wailing Death and Blighted Zombie (already reported), I just got 10 Argent Dawn rep off a Wandering Skeleton that I killed at around 3100/12000 Honored. So add Wandering Skeleton to the list of mobs that still give rep past Friendly. -- Rmunn 08:25, 15 October 2007 (UTC)


 * I'll have to drag my main (level 70) down to Gahrron's Withering to see if this behavior is affected by level. --Ravage 13:51, 16 October 2007 (UTC)


 * I also picked up 10 rep from a Stitched Horror in the Eastern Plaguelands at around 3200/12000 Honored. -- Rmunn 06:12, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Gibbering Ghoul and Stitched Horror (in addition to stitched golem), confirmed to give reputation in revered (may 11th, 2008). s.horror is currently listed as only giving rep through honored... and i'm too chicken to mess with the code : p. (Personal opinion: if this is blizz's idea of making AD rep easier to gain, I'm not doing this on any other character again. Barf. Any char you wish to farm AD rep on, do so before 65; too many mobs go grey and it just gets too evil too quick.) SannaSK (talk) 16:01, 12 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Add Crypt Slayers to the "still gives rep" list, too. -- Rmunn 05:58, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Will The Argent Dawn Be On The Front Lines?
With the war between mortals and the Scourge being taken to the front lines in Northrend next expansion, part of me is forced to wonder exactly what part the Argent Dawn will play in it. Currently, the majority of their operations have been in northern Lordaeron (the Plaguelands). We know - if anyone bothered to read all the plaques after killing Herod - that the Scarlet Crusade sent its own expedition, and made it as far as Icecrown itself. Probably slaughtered to a man, of course, but it says something anyway.

If the Argent Dawn's mission is to take on the Scourge, what better opportunity than in their backyard? --Joshmaul 12:02, 16 August 2007 (UTC)


 * []. The Dawn will be present in Zul'Drak. Xavius, the Satyr Lord (talk) 11:05, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

Speculation
Speculation tags are not an excuse for adding random theorising to an article. 05:00, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

What the Alliance should be
Given whats going on in the Plaguelands and the Dark Portal, I'm kind of surprised that the Horde and Alliance manage to keep holding onto their past history, especially with the evils of the Scourge, Burning Legion, Twilight's Hammer, and Shadow Council going out all over the place. The Argent Dawn, from the quests and their people, know what to do to stop these things. They believe in uniting the Horde and Alliance, and employ orcs and humans almost equally as footsoldiers. A lot of other Alliance and Horde forces everywhere are still fighting within themselves a lot. The Alliance seems to focus way to much on the Horde in Durotar and the Barrens, what with their outrunners and the Kul'Tiras marines always on the prowl. While the Horde seems not to realize that there are other places to harvest lumber rather than Ashenvale, the Alliance have a lot more pettiness they are holding onto. Stormwind and Ironforge should be working to unite the Horde and Alliance, like Thrall is, rather than trying to force the Frostwolves out of Alterac Valley, and continuiously attacking unnamed ships near Theramore. The Argent Dawn, in my opinion, is what the Alliance should be more like. They know what to do, who to fight, and how to keep the Horde and Alliance from killing each other. The Horde is pushing for more stable relations with the Alliance under Thrall, the Alliance should do the same under Bolvar and Magni. I applaud Blizzard for creating it, groups like this are something we need more of in WoW. Eman91 00:01, 5 May 2008 (UTC)Eman91

And WoWWiki cares because? This ain't a forum, kid. And aren't you the one who was alliance biased by editing how the orcs are angry at the dwarves in AV?  Mr.X8  Talk Contribs  23:29, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

Recent changes
Since my last edit I have seen a coule of edits that I find perplexing...


 * 1) removal of citations (to an authority I don't have in my possession)
 * 2) removal of disambiguation (vis Argent Dawn server)

I'd like to hear comments on these so I don't inadvertently revert something someone had good reason for. --Eirik Ratcatcher (talk) 23:47, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Argent Crusade
Shouldn't Argent Crusade have its own page, or is it going to be part of this page? Rolandius ( talk  -  contr ) 16:20, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

What is Argent Crusade? I have never encountered any such thing in the game? While on random Argent Dawn questions where is the proof that they are against the Forsaken or that they favor the Alliance? I'm not up to date with Dark Factions, but logically speaking ingame they don't give Alliance special treatment, is the favor the Alliance just based on the mainly Human build of the Argent Dawn NPCs?

Signed Langston the Coward
 * Read the Argent Crusade article. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 17:14, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Favors the Alliance?
Is there any proof at all in or out of game that Argent Dawn favors the Alliance?

Argent Dawn doesn't seem to make a distinction.

Is the Favors the Alliance based on an assumption that Humans means pro-Alliance? I could assure everyone there is nothing else about Argent Dawn to indicate Alliance, and even that is limited, Argent Dawn NPCs aren't all Humans.

There is not a single Argent Dawn anti-Horde quest or comment, Commander Dawnbringer gets annoyed at Scarlet Commander Marjhan for insulting the Horde.

So if nobody minds may I remove the innacurate Favors Alliance note?

Signed Langston the Coward


 * Favoring Alliance is established in the Warcraft RPG. I'll add a citation.Baggins (talk) 23:32, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Existence
The Argent Dawn does not exist anymore since it is now the Argent Crusade correct? Rolandius ( talk  -  contr ) 07:44, 18 December 2008 (UTC)


 * The reputation faction still exists. 09:04, 18 December 2008 (UTC)


 * If you read the Argent Crusade page it seems to say that it was created from the combining of the two forces. I am not sure how the Argent Dawn could still exist. For instance, isn't Dispatch Commander Metz of the Argent Dawn now Avenger Metz of the Argent Crusade? I am not saying that the Argent Dawn is not around anymore but how do we explain it all lore-wise and everything. I don't think any phasing or quests are involved to explain people like Metz being in two places at once, yet part of two different factions. Rolandius [[Image:Paladin.gif|25px]] ( talk -  contr ) 10:21, 18 December 2008 (UTC)


 * If you want to be as hardcore as removing the faction from the game, then yes, it wouldn't exist. However the faction still exists in the game. 10:30, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

Reputation
Currently (27/12/08) you still gain full rep for trash mobs in Stratholme and Scholomance when Revered. I'm not sure when they changed it though. --Ameria (talk) 08:45, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Changed it so that people can rep the old world stuff when they're high level. I got over 3,000 reputation for a full clear of Stratholme at 80, including turning in the Crypt Fiend Parts and such. I got an extra 1,000 for doing one of the quests I hadn't completed before - pretty productive -Howbizr (talk) 00:42, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

Capitol?
Capitol is Darnassus?--Knighthonor (talk) 22:49, July 16, 2010 (UTC)
 * According to Dark Factions, yes it is one of their Headquarters. 23:20, July 16, 2010 (UTC)