Wowpedia talk:Main Page Dev/Archive03

Moved
I moved the entire discussion of Main Page contents to Wowpedia talk:Main Page Dev, and am setting up a prototype Main Page at Main Page Dev - Please do not edit that page! Please discuss all changes here and let me administer them, as I use a somewhat... unique formatting style, trying to edit it in this prototype stage might break the formatting. Anyway, if you want to see something on the main page, drop a line here and I'll see where it will best work in!
 * - 16:07, 1 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * I added a *whole* buncha stuff to the Main Page Dev - about 3 hours of work. What's everybody think?
 * - 17:01, 1 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * This is a bit too colorful, don't you think?
 * -- AlexanderYoshi 07:03, 3 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * No I don't - see your talk page (-:
 * [[User:SilverSide| Silver\Side]] 17:41, 3 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * I have to agree, there's too many colors.
 * --Powerlord 00:35, 14 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * Please add WoW EU Forums to the main page, maybe under the social tab. Thanks :)
 * -- Aithne 09:05, 5 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * I have no affect on the actual main page at the moment - it will be obvious when I do (It will look more like this one) - but you can go ahead and add that to the appropriate section on this Main_Page_Dev (which will be moved to Main_Page at some time in the future)
 * Silverhttp://avxworkshop.com/img/ss16.pngSide|undefined 19:00, 6 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * Why is Talk:Main Page redirecting to Wowpedia talk:Main Page Dev? I was under the impression that Wowpedia talk:Main Page Dev was for discussion about Main Page Dev, rather than the site's current main page.
 * --Powerlord 00:33, 14 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * This *IS* the discussion of the main page. The admins are on indefinite Wikibreak, and we cannot change the main page; so we are setting up a main page as we want it here for them to move over to the real main page as soon as they get around to existing again.  Make sense? --  &#8465;ilver&#167;&#8465;ide|undefined 04:58, 14 Dec 2005 (EST)
 * You are aware that AlexanderYoshi is an admin, right? You know, the guy that posted on December 3?  Of course, you knew that, and was hoping that the average reader didn't.
 * I think it's perfectly clear that this page isn't the main page, because you have no authority to make it the main page. However, you seem to think that this will become the main page "(which will be moved to Main_Page at some time in the future)."  This isn't your decision, it's the decision of AlexanderYoshi and Rustak.  As for Adminship: As a general rule in communities, if you ask for it, you won't get it.
 * --Powerlord 14:50, 17 Dec 2005 (EST)
 * "" if you ask for it, you won't get it. "" Correct. Dont "expect" or ask for a thing such as adminship. If and when "the powers that be" need help they'll find someone.. and generally when they do, its "not" one of the people standing in the front begging for it. Presumptions and assumptions dont make for too great of a show either. The Main page does need an overhaul however. hence this talk page exists. CJ 08:14, 19 Dec 2005 (EST)

DB Errors
Moving pages while working in Mac Safari causes an error. the page moves fine though. --CJ 08:41, 9 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * ah, thanks - just figured that out - there are some bad errors though (will explain later) -- &#8465;ilver&#167;&#8465;ide|undefined 11:41, 9 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * This problem is not browser or platform specific... I see this on a Powerbook (Safari) and a Thinkpad (FireFox).
 * --Fandyllic 00:25-8hrs (PST) 14 December 2005

Patches
A link to the patch notes page might be a nice addition to the front page ( its rather hard to find ) . --CrazyJack

Ouch
Ok, I don't want to be an ass, but those colors hurt my eyes. Plus you've removed all of the UI links which I think are the most trafficed parts of the site. Keep all the orig links with a format like you have now, but drop the colors and stick with outlines. Or just let people edit it... And whoever put that sub tag in there that says he editted the banner template IS an ass... --KarlKFI
 * Yay, I'm an ass! --Fandyllic -8hrs (PST) 27 August 2005
 * ROFL at that mate... LOL LAMO -- &#8465;ilver&#167;&#8465;ide|undefined 19:02, 15 Dec 2005 (EST)
 * P.S. I think that's the most laughing acronyms I have ever put in one sentence... roflmfwao!


 * On the subject of colors, I set them to various shades of grey - better? Wanted to emphasize differences between areas. Compare with Main page and Community portal - hmmm? --  &#8465;ilver&#167;&#8465;ide|undefined 19:06, 15 Dec 2005 (EST)

Archived, and extreme dislike
Ok, first so that I say something and give myself time while typing to cool down, I archived this page again, it's getting too long. That wasn't long enough. Nope, still exasperated - ok, takign the time to figure out how to spell exasperated was enough. Anyway, I hate those borders. That's a personal thing, and now that it has seen my revision and your revision, reverting would be a violation and just plain jerk action; so I think it needs a vote; see Wowpedia talk:Main Page Dev/Border vote. Ok, that was a personal thing, but this is a logical one that actually affects the running of the main page. Let me have you look at Main Page for a sec - see it? yes? how about the featured article, yes? ok, now look for a list of the major contents of the wiki. What? Where is it? Not there, I say... and I say rightly because it isn't. Now  think about how much more information Wikipedia holds than WoWWiki, and how many more iterations it has gone through; there are reasons not to simply list important pages prominently on the front page. If a user comes looking for something specific, then they will use the search - and there is more important info to be displayed on the main page than that. News, featured article, other WoW sites, help on using WoWWiki, how to help WoWWiki expand, ETC. I say we create some kind of Browse portal and link it from the main page - it can list oft-visited pages and such like that, but it does not need to be the first thing on there; and it should probably be listed along with the other browse methods like A—Z, and FAQ, and Ask A Question - in fact, putting it there now! Hmmm interesting, lemme hear you thoughts on what I just did. Anyway though, I will change the borders back, and ask you to leave it until a vote is taken (see the page, listed above). -- &#8465;ilver&#167;&#8465;ide|undefined 20:35, 15 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * WoWWiki is not Wikipedia! It exists for a niche audience on a comparably narrow subject. Before you presume to know what most people do (you presume they use search alot), why don't you ask! I'll tell you that I don't use search much. Also, if you make search the only thing you can do unless you have a particular coincidental interest on what's on the front page (like wikipedia)... well, duh, people are going to use search! What I don't get about wikipedia is why they don't put the search in a prominent place in the middle of the stupid main page rather than in a little spot on the sidebar. Also, it is obvious you are mostly trying re-make WoWWiki in the image of wikipedia without much regard to anyone in the WoWWiki community!


 * More about searching: One thing I find is that if you are familiar with the WoWWiki structure, clicking a few links is much faster than typing something in search and clicking a button.
 * Lets take an example: Murloc
 * Search: Type "Murloc" in the search field and click Search button. That's 6 letters and a click, then you have to look for the right murloc article and click it.
 * Navigate from main page: If I had a Creatures category link there, I would click it, look for Murloc under M and click Murloc. That's 1 click, maybe a scroll or 3 and click Murloc. Much faster in my mind.


 * Also, you seem to be reverting to your old ways of making changes without much direct explanation. You pretty much nuked all my changes and hid my explanation in an archive before anyone could see what I'd done. Do I have to make a Main_Page_Dev_Alt to let people see what I did without you getting all huffy and reverting it right away?


 * I have more I'd like to say, but I'd rather other folks put in their, first. --Fandyllic 02:37-8hrs (PST) 15 December 2005
 * P.S. If you want to see what the Main Page Dev looked like before it got reverted... Fandyllic pseudo-version


 * Umm as I see it in my version, they click the Monsters category at the VERY TOP OF THE PAGE, then scroll down a bit and find Murloc; or perhaps they click Browse, then your system (it is still there, duh!), or perhaps they click A—Z and navigate to MU... or search or list or caategorylist or or or or or... point being my way works fine! Search is not the only way, infact the easiest way (looking in category:monsters ((See below)) ) is at the very top of the page under welcome to WoWWiki! --  &#8465;ilver&#167;&#8465;ide|undefined 22:22, 15 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * Schmidt's ideas:
 * For featured articles, maybe we could have some lore. And we wouldn't have to change it every day. We could change it once a week, or once every two weeks, or unscheduled.
 * If we had a legitimate "goto" box like WP did, I'd much rather type murloc in that box and go straight there. It's faster for me, because I type pretty quickly. And if I had a bookmark to WP's article on Linux, I'd rather go to WP's site (or type wp in my address bar in Firefox) and type kernel rather than going to WP's article on Linux and then clicking kernel on that page. So in fact, I've even erased the appendage to the wowwiki.com in the address bar and changed it to what I knew the address would be. I so hate the Google search. (But I know that it must be there, if we're to find what we're looking for if we don't know the address.)
 * I like outset rather than inset or solid.
 * I feel like I'm missing something else, but oh well, it'll have to wait until next time. Schmidt 22:54, 15 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * In response to Fandyllic: I agree with SilverSide on the layout topic of the Main Page. Or if anything, I'd go even more minimalist than he has in his layout.  (Not that I agree with the color choices or combinations, but meh.)  While the comment "this is not wikipedia" is taken to heart, I can't find anything that I normally look for on WoWWiki via the main page or the community portal.  The organization (or lack thereof) is too arcane for me to intuit.  I typically use search for anything I want to find, or edit the URL directly when I've become familiar with the exact URL.  And for the records, I'm typically visiting the pages on the end-game dungeons (i.e., Molten Core, Zul'Gurub, Blackwing Lair and Onyxia's Lair, and sometimes visiting the various  API pages.))
 * PS, do you have any standardize talk format policy? Trying to figure out who is responding to whom when I've not been reading the conversation as it develops is something of a challenge. I've taken to putting   around my comments to ensure that they can be logically grouped by anyone unfamiliar with a wiki. --Mazian 12:43, 16 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * The standard format for a wiki is earthier an indentation or list format - list format is used more often; unfortunatly people here got hooked on indentation early on. List format makes it easy, however.  --  &#8465;ilver&#167;&#8465;ide|undefined 12:55, 16 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * Oh well, it looks I'm losing this round. C'est la vie... I guess it doesn't matter until one of the admins reads any of this. For the record (if you haven't figured it out already), I hate the wikipedia front page. Also, WoWWiki did have a goto before the search was switched to Google, but the search didn't work at all most of the time.
 * --Fandyllic 11:06 PST 16 Dec 2005


 * This draft is nice.
 * --Xmuskrat 16:04, 16 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * Wikipedia DID go through a number of iterations until it found what the best front page was for it. The search is good, but not great - it doesn't take you straight to a 100% result page.  The front page is a good start, but it's not complete - the categories need to be sorted out.  WowWWikki has not yet formalised its overall taxonomy.  I find the front page confusing because it is not YET intuitive.  One other thing - this is a collective and collaborative medium, and should not reflect the ideas and decisions of ONE person.  --Kiwanotree 16:29, 16 Dec 2005 (EST)


 * Please stop archiving ongoing conversations. --Powerlord 14:32, 17 Dec 2005 (EST)