Talk:Alterac Valley tactical overview

Frostwolf keep
I really don't get why Horde complain about the Alliance ability to jump over the fence into the village, and how it could be equatored to Horde jumping over the Dun Baldar bridge. It bypasses potentially 2 npcs, which I aggro anyway (so as to avoid ye old blacksmith et all. ;)), and in the race games of today, its almost pointless anyway. Even in the old games it was limited at best, just adds abit of character to the map, without much advantage to the alliance. If someone could explain why its such a big deal, I'd love to know. Thanks in advance. --Talgar 23:50, 21 December 2006 (EST)

I think it's more just a general lack of a chokepoint that defenders can funnel the Alliance into and pummel with range/spell fire, like the bridge to Dun Baldar and the approach to Stormpike - granted, they still have to navigate through the gate between both Frostwolf Towers. Nonetheless, the choke area you can pummel them within is rather small in comparison to the bridge and enemies can duck into the towers for cover - not as easy to do with the Stormpike bunkers, and it's surprising how often the Aid station gets ninja'ed in the middle of pitched combat from within the small trench nearby, where it can be difficult to spot shorter allance players, like gnomes. I think it's more an overall (mis)perception that a "choke point" should be outside the base, not within it. Pendragon 00:15, 12 March 2007 (EDT)

Stormpike Graveyard
I realize this isn't Wikipedia and the NPOV isn't so important here, yet sections of this article read as clearly the opinion of one Alliance player rather than a general consensus. In particular, the line questioning why Horde players don't always take the "high road" to SPGY. My answer to that ties in to my theory why SPGY is so hard to take: distance between graveyards.

It takes defenders no more than 10s to reach the flagpole. I just timed the run from SHGY to the flag, taking the high road: 1:09, with an epic mount and riding crop. If combat takes 30s on average (a made up number), defenders are in play 75% of the time but Horde players only 25% of the time. This means that if we completely ignore terrain advantages and the difficulty of clicking, the strength of the defense is 3x as big as the offense. (If it takes a whole minute on average, the ratio becomes 85%/52%=1.6x.) Obviously, real combat is not this simple, but I think this demonstrates the primary hurdle that attackers of SPGY face.

To address some expected counter-arguments, yes, the Horde do have a similar GY run: IW->FW. However, as is acknowledged in this article, the terrain of FWGY offers no advantage at all to the defenders. Additionally, the Alliance cave is much closer to the GY than the Horde cave (and has better geographic advantage), making defending after a flip much easier. In my view, if each side sends 2/3rds of its players on offense and 1/3 or defense, given equal teams the Alliance will be able to hold SPGY indefinitely, allowing the Alliance assault plenty of time to break down the weaker Horde defenses. So, unless I hear any objections, I will make a few changes to this article which note that the major advantage of SP is its distance to the attacker's GY. Dandelion 22:36, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

Well, as I am only one alliance player I didn't want to state my opinions as a general consensus. I'm not quite sure what you want to add to the article, as I feel that defenders of any flag always have an advantage in that they will spawn closer, it's a given that I have only mentioned to qualify Frostwolf GY.Also, I've noted the advantage alliance have from the cave start to recapture. Feel free to add to the article if I've not understood you.--Talgar 01:56, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

"Horde single pulling Vanndar" bug
Should the bug where the Horde can pull Vanndar and kill him without pulling the Marshals be mentioned in here somewhere? It's been a big issue for players my battlegroup since the last patch, but I'm not aware if the problem is widespread. StarNeptune 04:07, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

Flag contradictions
(Quote)
 * Alliance advantage: The bridge serves as an excellent defence and is covered by the Northern bunker. Flags within each bunker are covered by archers. Npcs are easily aggroed within the base.
 * Horde advantage: Horde attackers can avoid npcs and are less visible moving around the north of the north bunker. Once horde assaults a bunker, it serves as an excellent fire base for the horde, a fact that is, bizarrely, not so for the alliance. Flags in bunkers can be capped without being hit by archers, albeit not as easily. " (Endquote)

This isn't real clear. Are the flags covered by archers, or are they not? If they can be caputred without being hit by archers, I would call that 'not'. --Azaram 06:59, 5 December 2007 (UTC)


 * It is possible to capture Alliance Bunkers without getting hit by the Archers. But extremely difficult because from any angle, there will always be at least 1 Archer who can hit you and interrupt the cap. It is a matter of aggro. If you happen to aggro that Archer, you won't be able to cap it alone. --Invin Dranoel 14:41, 5 December 2007 (UTC)