Wowpedia talk:List of creature icons

Requests

 * Requests for new icons should be placed here.

''When making a request, please bear in mind the usefulness of the icon, in other words will it be used? Generally NYI races/creatures should not be requested as making the icon does require some sort of image to work off of. Creatures of similar nature or different skin/fur colors should also not be requested, for example we don't need a icon for polar bears, black bears, and brown bears.''

Addendum: Don't request icons of content that hasn't gone live yet.

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Elementals/Constructs

 * Corrupted Ancient
 * Saronite Animus
 * Northrend Iron golem
 * Fel golem
 * Fire Noble
 * Earth Noble
 * Firekin/Flamekin
 * Fire spider (smaller ones)
 * Fire Cat Form

Dragonkin

 * Azure dragonspawn
 * Azure dragonwhelp
 * Azure drakonid


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Beasts

 * Spirit Owl
 * Celestial Dragon

Giants

 * Molten giant (updated )

Other

 * Drakkari God Statues (the statues of Zim'torga, zim'rhuk, Zim'abwa or Dubra'jin)
 * Drakkari God Statues (the statues of Zim'torga, zim'rhuk, Zim'abwa or Dubra'jin)


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Mechanical/Animated objects

 * Plague spreader
 * Gnomish Flame Turret
 * Goblin Land Mine
 * Animated Weaponry (Unholy Swords, Unholy Axe, Unholy Stave, Ethereum Mace pick one)

Undead

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 * }

Removal replies

 * Please do not respond here, start a new section at the bottom if removal is disputed.


 * Removed: Fire hawk egg, Cinderweb Egg
 * 1 minor object isn't enough for a creature icon request


 * Removed: Gilnean Children
 * Only difference is clothing. Icons are made of faces, not bodies.


 * Removed: Clockwerk goblin, Ancient of Wind, Ancient of Wonder, Tree of Life/Ages/Eternity, Mur'gul, Mutant murloc, Nerubian queen, Forgotten one, Arachnathid, Owl scout
 * The models are on WC3 and not WOW


 * Removed: Boat, Deeprun Tram, Zeppelin, Horde Submarine, Alliance Submarine, Big Bomb, Orb of Translocation, Gnome Drag Car, Goblin Drag Car
 * Would serve no purpose.


 * Removed: Incubus
 * Have no graphics that can be used for icons. - yellow


 * Removed: Female Dragonspawn (dragonspawn casters are female)
 * No Proof, except for slender form, and the breasts.


 * Removed: Mechanical Yeti, Jewelcrafting Boar, Mechanical Greench, and Lifelike Mechanical Toad. /
 * They have no distinct look from the actual creatures they portray.


 * Removed: Felboar / Mage Slayer / Baby Blizzard Bear / Onyxian whelpling and Onyxian Drake.
 * Felboar can use / Mage slayer can use  / Baby Blizzard Bears can use . / Onyxian Whelpling and Drake can use

Completed requests

 * Spirit Worg
 * Cinderweb Spider
 * Druids of the Flame


 * Elementium Monstrosity
 * Goblin Zombie
 * Female Tigon
 * Gemstone colossus
 * Titanic Guardian
 * Saber Cub
 * Gilnean Raven
 * Cataclysm Crocolisk
 * Baby hippogryph
 * Air noble
 * Winged Guardian
 * Goblin child
 * Spirit Crab
 * Spirit Saber Cat


 * Chaos Orc
 * Northrend Ghoul
 * Ancient of Arcane
 * Bone Giant
 * Tol'vir
 * Ramkahen
 * Celestial Steed
 * Reins of the Golden King
 * Reins of the Kor'kron Annihilator
 * Neptulon Water lord
 * Mimiron's Head
 * Guardian of Ancient Kings
 * Brazie's Sunflower Seeds Sunflower
 * Al'akir Air lord

Latest Update List
A list of new models from latest update, which is Cataclysm 4.0 and 4.1 and Previews of 4.2:

4.1
 * Beasts
 * Big Cats Cub
 * Winged Guardian
 * Hippogryph Hatchling
 * Humanoid
 * Goblin children

4.2 Preview
 * Elemental
 * Hell hound
 * Fire hawk
 * Fire hawk egg
 * Fire Noble
 * Earth Noble
 * Cinderweb Brood
 * Cinderweb Spider
 * Cinderweb Spiderling
 * Cinderweb Egg
 * Molten Cat
 * Flameward Hyppogryph
 * Fire Raven God


 * Humanoid
 * Druids of the Flame
 * Giant
 * Cataclysm Molten giant
 * Beast
 * Epic Wolf
 * Epic Horse
 * Guardian cub
 * Celestial Dragon
 * Owl Scout

Cataclysm Icons
When can we start asking for cataclysm icons? when it releases accordying to assumptions we already have a ettin model(it's a two headed giant with a roof as a shoulder--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:48, May 7, 2010 (UTC))


 * Don't request any icons until it's at least in beta. 00:52, May 7, 2010 (UTC)


 * Of course :P--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:53, May 7, 2010 (UTC)


 * I made a column just for cataclysm beta because these things might change a lot and some are upgrades to other icons--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:04, May 7, 2010 (UTC)


 * hmm...... 01:05, May 7, 2010 (UTC)


 * We already have the models of all of those(at least mmo champion shows them) adding a few more for the sake of completness--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:19, May 7, 2010 (UTC)


 * MMO champion show things you are not supposed to know exist, as hard as it can be, you must forget this website when editing wowwiki :)
 * 07:08, May 7, 2010 (UTC)

Female dragonspawn
Why was this removed?

If I'm not blind, dragonspawn casters have breasts. If that doesn't make you female enough, I don't know what does.--Lon-ami (talk) 11:21, June 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * There was a reason written, anyway ask coobra he's the one taking care of this area--Ashbear160 (talk) 11:58, June 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * Aye, I have noticed the breasts... but I personally don't see the use in clarifying the different genders, when Blizzard themselves doesn't even state genders of the dragonspawn. And it's just a model, just seems weird that all casters are female and all brutes and higher ranks are males. Not to mention the racial icons won't show the breasts and will appear almost exactly the same as the current "male" one. But I'll make an example icon, upload, and then compare... soonish. 18:12, June 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * Well, they have a smaller face, and they have hoods, too. I think having them is nice, and the icons are going to be used sure. We did the same with the quilboars some time ago, and the result was nice.--Lon-ami (talk) 18:23, June 15, 2010 (UTC)
 * Hmm, well I did make them a while ago... been hesitant on uploading cause I really don't want to see them thrown into things like ... I personally find 5 icons already a bit much. 03:09, 17 February 2011 (UTC)

Death knights of each race
I think we need icons for each race. Right now, we only have for humans and orcs (and they should be updated).

For the tauren one, we could recycle Trag Highmountain.

I would create them myself, but my WoWModelViewer doesn't work properly with textures.--Lon-ami (talk) 11:27, June 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * I think it was because it was too much work, again ask coobra--Ashbear160 (talk) 11:59, June 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * Personally after making the orc and then human versions, I wasn't happy with them, so I stopped. Now if someone else wants to pick up the reins on this, that's fine. But don't just upload anything, it should at least be presentable, clean, and easy to identify. 18:07, June 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * I think we should avoid picture-icons, and use model shots. I think you'd have gotten a better result if you had taken screenshots instead of recoloring the existing icons :S.--Lon-ami (talk) 18:29, June 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * Ok, I made improvements to the human and orc versions, tell me what you think. 06:05, June 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * I have to say, at first sight, I believe the orc were ghouls!
 * 07:01, June 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * Oh-my-god. They're simply AWESOME. You made them yourself, or you took screenshots? I love them, man, seriously. Great work, and looking forward the other races if you decide to make more.--Lon-ami (talk) 10:15, June 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * Yes these are a vast improved over the old ones, i would love to see the other 16 icons, but that would be to much of a hassle--Ashbear160 (talk) 16:02, June 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * Will it be useful anyway to have one of each?
 * 16:07, June 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * Of course yes, we have NPCs and important characters in-game that are death knights from all the races. Using normal icons for them is, well, wrong. They're a different "race", anyway.--Lon-ami (talk) 16:24, June 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * Well, I'm happy you all liked them. =) I don't know about all races (I might do them all in the end), but I did notice on the list of DKs, that at least gnome, tauren, troll, and draenei would be nice to have.  20:16, June 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * Though we could just use for the trolls... great power out, damn storm...  21:26, June 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * I have no problem but i want to avoid repetition if those were used for regular undead trolls--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:37, June 17, 2010 (UTC)

Tauren death knight icons
So, for those who didn't notice, Coobra updated these icons: and.

I think they are great, but I think they need a bit more "zoom". I think they would work better if the "photo" was taken from further. See.

Just my opinion ;).--Lon-ami (talk) 08:02, June 18, 2010 (UTC)
 * Perhaps.. Beast-like humanoids can be a tad annoying to make icons for. Shoulders and such always tend to get in the way. I zoomed out a little... can't say I'm completely happy with the results.. I might start over on the tauren. 20:54, June 18, 2010 (UTC)

Blood elf DKs
I was thinking of moving UndeadElf to DarkRanger since it seems the only models to use that skin are dark rangers, then make a similar one for DKs... however, then I remembered Bloodrose Datura. She used the red eye version... So, question. Do you think we should just use this icon for the DKs or go ahead with what I was thinking? 22:31, June 18, 2010 (UTC)


 * Hmm, getting reports her eyes are no longer red, but blue like the rest of the DKs... Can anyone confirm this? 22:34, June 18, 2010 (UTC)


 * Eyes are blue now according to wowhead, in my opinion you should make a new one for blood elf and leave undead elf as it is--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:58, June 18, 2010 (UTC)


 * Undead elf is just like human cultist, leave it as it is, and make new ones for death knights. After all, those icons are already used for darkfallen and dark rangers.--Lon-ami (talk) 10:40, June 19, 2010 (UTC)

Forsaken Deathknights
Coobra i don't want to be mean but don't the forsaken deathknights have a paler skin and blue eyes than normal forsaken, like for example in this skin, i'm okay with the troll death knights since it has blue eyes, but i'd prefer if you or anyone that wanted do it change the forsaken death knight, so i'm going to put it back on the list.--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:42, August 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * If someone wants to, that's fine, but I'm not going to make a new icon for just eye color difference. To me it's pointless. 22:54, August 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok if i was able i would do it but alas i'm not--Ashbear160 (talk) 13:13, August 9, 2010 (UTC)


 * Finally, thank you varghedin for completing the deathknight icons--Ashbear160 (talk) 13:15, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Cataclysm List
A list of new models from cataclysm: Transfred to the beginning of the page

Some of these might be datamined(if admins have problems tell me and i remove them each one that is datamined), also mind that this is not request list, but a list to show what new models are there, so the icon makers (sadly i'm not one of them) to know what new races are out there--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:43, July 1, 2010 (UTC)


 * Tol'vir added, they're still not in-game, but they'll be soon :).--Lon-ami (talk) 17:57, July 1, 2010 (UTC)
 * List updated--Ashbear160 (talk) 15:01, July 21, 2010 (UTC)
 * List reupdated--Ashbear160 (talk) 14:34, August 1, 2010 (UTC)
 * Added icons for existing ones, and those that are marked with is used as a subsitute of the image to make it easier for when someone wants to add the image--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:27, August 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * I've made a lot of icons, but I will not upload them till they've been seen in-game. Seems many of these are datamined, but I'm going to let it slide for now. 03:29, August 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well i said there would be datamined in here because i'm not in Beta, I've known for a fact that some of these are already in beta like bound elementals in ambermill and such, anyway i have two questions:
 * -For the deep sea turtle did you use the Tortolla model? because that would be a slight problem.EDIT: you didn't use it seems the colouring is just very similar, my bad...
 * -When i added waterlord to the list i was requesting a new icon based on the new ingame model, it seems that this is the old photoshopped picture so i'm going to remove it because this is a list for cataclysm models, if you don't mind, the new model is also not datamined.
 * Thanks--Ashbear160 (talk) 12:31, August 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * Added angel and twilight ascendant earth--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:48, August 14, 2010 (UTC)
 * Coobra can you tell me which models you have done, that you think are datamined, so i can scratch them from the list so nobody else does repeats?--Ashbear160 (talk) 10:59, August 15, 2010 (UTC)
 * At this point, I'm not completely clear what has been officially seen or not, but it doesn't matter... don't think anyone else is making icons. 03:33, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * I know of some that have been seen that are not on the list trough--Ashbear160 (talk) 09:30, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * Go ahead and add them. 22:34, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * I trid to make the icons but they were horrible :S--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:22, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * Added types of elemental drake--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:29, August 23, 2010 (UTC)

What is meant by Big Bomb? The bomb inside alliance gunships? 23:15, September 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * The Bomb that is dropped in stonetalon mountains on the druid city, also the reason i added to teh cataclysm list is because we have the fire lord, air lord, and earth lord that are used only once for a character, so do we add water lord to this list or we remove all lords from this list and put in the other?--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:49, September 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * Added two deephome drakes and the scorpion guild mount--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:59, September 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Added Mercury Unbound elemental(at least i think it's unbound it's grouped with unbound elementals)
 * Added 4 from the newest beta patch--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:37, October 2, 2010 (UTC)

And so you're going to keep adding "races" that aren't actually races? -- 22:46, October 2, 2010 (UTC)

The list is now easier to see which aren't complete Also added the dragonman colours that were on the youtube video showing it--Ashbear160 (talk) 14:40, October 8, 2010 (UTC)


 * All the mercury ooze creatures are technically elementals. Only reason I gave them their own icon. 23:10, October 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * ... Well we don't know that, Oozes are weird and have strange qualities, if consumption of them grants elemental ascension it's probably due to their relatedness with old gods among other strange things, i prefer if we keep thing together oozes with oozes at least until we have more information--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:27, October 9, 2010 (UTC)


 * No I mean, every creature using the mercury ooze model is classified as an elemental, whereas mostly all other oozes are unclassified. 23:30, October 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * I didn't mean the ingame classification i meant the whole mercury vibe blizzard is giving, as mercury is not a traditional classical element but more of a atomic element so he might turn to be like Murmur or some other weird explination--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:37, October 9, 2010 (UTC)


 * True... doubt we'll get an answer though... seems we don't get much background/lore on new creatures anymore... 23:46, October 9, 2010 (UTC)


 * If we don't i'll ask when the dev questions come after the cataclysm release(i meant i will ask someone on scrolls of lore to post it on wow story forums)--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:49, October 9, 2010 (UTC)

Non-races
Removed vehicles and other things that, in fact, aren't races. -- 22:45, October 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * i'm going to undo it because this is a project page(this is only here to help edit and not exactly to direct people) and it's designed to put icons based on creature models, wherever they are not races or not that's a problem with the title and not with the content--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:44, October 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * In fact the article has this written "The term "race" is used in a very broad sense." this page is a guide to the small icons not a list for someone to check for races--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:52, October 2, 2010 (UTC)


 * They still aren't races. If it's going to be about creature icons, then it should renamed. -- 23:49, October 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * Talk to coobra he's the one that i ask when i have doubts about this page and he does most of the icons, so yeah check with him but for now i suggest to let it be so it does not create needless confusion--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:52, October 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * But if you're in a hurry i assume Creature would be more correct than Race, and i would prefer to creature so it's less confusing, just don't remove the icons, please--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:01, October 3, 2010 (UTC)

About the moving (from race to creature)
I think "List of race icons" was better, just because: I think it was better like before. If I've missed any discussion around this, please link it to me, since I can't find it anywhere :S.--Lon-ami (talk) 09:27, October 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * Race, no matter being incorrect, is more used than creature to define diferent species
 * The two template for the icons are called RaceIcon and Race
 * It was because mechanical things wouldn't fit, and creatures fit everything, also those 2 don't matter it's not like you'll see them unless you edit...--Ashbear160 (talk) 10:55, October 3, 2010 (UTC)


 * It still doesn't make sense. Race was fine, imo.--Lon-ami (talk) 14:50, October 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * Gourra didn't agree and after pointed out i too don't agree--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:36, October 8, 2010 (UTC)


 * I still think it doesn't make sense... this is a list of "RaceIcon", and the same way you don't call mechanical stuff races, you don't call them creatures, either.--Lon-ami (talk) 09:04, October 18, 2010 (UTC)


 * Because the term race is usually used to reference sapient beings while the term creature sentient beings--Ashbear160 (talk) 10:53, October 18, 2010 (UTC)


 * I still think "List of race icons" was a better name, after all, we have a lot of stuff that isn't creatures in here, like boats and mechanical constructs. This is a list of RaceIcon templates, not of CreatureIcon. Also, it's shorter, easier and more user-friendly to use race instead of creature.
 * I would like to have a vote on this if it doesn't get solved.--Lon-ami (talk) 17:22, 20 January 2011 (UTC)
 * To me it doesn't matter what it's named, as long as the article itself and it's purpose isn't damage by it.--Ashbear160 (talk) 17:34, 20 January 2011 (UTC)


 * Bumping this to see if more people comments, if not, guess I'll be able to move it back?--Lon-ami (talk) 13:46, 23 January 2011 (UTC)


 * I think that neither "race" nor "creature" is an ideal term for the icons, but seeing as they already are named race icons, I'd rather the page name reflect that rather than trying to artificially give it a different name that is about equally ill-fitting. --Varghedin (talk) 23:08, 23 January 2011 (UTC)


 * Good to see you got my point, Varghedin :).--Lon-ami (talk) 09:42, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Tiny change in the elemental category
I'm going to change a small part of the four main elemental template, instead of using it by alphabet, it would be by rank however i'll explain better later--Ashbear160 (talk) 12:15, October 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well the idea is this instead of doing by alphabet, we put first by ranks, like the word Fire in fire elemental is the first letter of the alphabet in that category i'll make a small example on how it would go:

what do you think? Here is what would constitute the changes below:
 * Element
 * Elemental
 * Unbound
 * Bound
 * Revenant
 * Lord
 * Anything extra is below here by alphabet


 * Air
 * Air elemental
 * Bound air elemental
 * Unbound air elemental
 * Air lord
 * Lightning revenant
 * Djinni
 * Mana surge
 * Arcane wraith


 * Earth
 * Earth elemental
 * Bound earth elemental
 * Unbound earth elemental
 * Earth lord
 * Earth revenant
 * Death revenant
 * Geode
 * Gyreworm
 * Shale spider


 * Fire
 * Fire elemental
 * Bound fire elemental
 * Unbound fire elemental
 * Fire lord
 * Fire revenant
 * Entropic beast
 * Fel Firelord
 * Flamewaker
 * Phoenix
 * Dark Phoenix


 * Water
 * Water elemental
 * Bound water elemental
 * Unbound water elemental
 * Water revenant

--Ashbear160 (talk) 13:45, October 10, 2010 (UTC)


 * If you want to do it by rank, you may want to check out the elemental hierarchy. Since we don't seem to have the table anywhere... I went and made one it's not a clean version, but it gets the job done for now... its at User:Coobra/sandbox7. 20:53, October 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * It seems size may count for their rank among them... so if they were to be organized by rank, adding the new elementals in between the rest could essentially be done. And the lords should bottom the list. 21:02, October 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * It's not literally by rank just those that the only difference is the element they represent, but have examples in all four classical elements, Like having the word fire in the fire elemental section would be considered the first letter of the alphabet--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:21, October 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * So can i change it to the example above?changed it slightly, now it's by alphabetic orderbut considers things that have examples in the other element has first letter of the alphabet --Ashbear160 (talk) 10:41, October 12, 2010 (UTC)


 * Sure. 20:47, October 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:17, October 12, 2010 (UTC)

Regarding the Tol'vir
Regarding the Tolvir, do we really need to have icon for each color? Just asking, but we neither have icon for each color of humans hair. Neutralion (talk) 17:24, October 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * I added all skins because they represented different skins very differently, but i also added the green square before tol'vir if somebody just wants to do one icon instead of all of them i also added this to ramhaken, dragonman, skywall and deepholm drake--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:15, October 12, 2010 (UTC)

Changes to icons
I have noticed icons have been slightly edited. Someone has added a line of "brown2 pixles above their heads. See here: I'm not sure if they look better this way... opinions?--Lon-ami (talk) 14:21, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
 * File:IconSmall HumanDeathKnight Male.gif


 * The user went through many icons making them similar to how the main races are.... I'm waiting to see how the public views it... though if he doesn't finish them, I might just revert just to have a standard look. Cause I know many icons I made don't take in account for the loss of details due to a "button" feel to them. 01:38, 22 November 2010 (UTC)


 * I would say remove the buttons, because they are very small images and we cannot afford to loose 2 pixels for something purely cosmetical instead of more details.
 * 08:04, 22 November 2010 (UTC)


 * It wouldn't mind however, it's much lighter than the other buttons so it kinda looks bad, if it was on a much darker colour like the original buttons i wouldn't have minded at all, just look at the playable orc button to see what i mean, compare the difference between male and female--Ashbear160 (talk) 13:22, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

So I'm hearing a dislike to the changes being done to the icons then? If no one objects we can start reverting them back... I'll check back for objections in about a week, if any. 02:35, 23 November 2010 (UTC)


 * First, hello eveyone, the reason why I edit the icons is that I think that now looks better, also for the look-a-like with the principal icons, but if you wanna change it, do it, for me it′s fine. -- Kandooww 20:49, 23 November 2010 (UTC)


 * I like the new look of the icons. -- 20:19, 23 November 2010 (UTC)


 * I think the colour is too light compared to the rest of the button and much lighter than the original buttons, make it more like the original ones and i have no problem--Ashbear160 (talk) 20:34, 23 November 2010 (UTC)


 * I've always been of the opinion that we should replace all the "art" icons for "model" icons, but well. I liked the original ones more :(.
 * And yeah, I'm with A'noob regarding the loss of pixels.--Lon-ami (talk) 10:33, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

Over the Top
As one of the pioneers among race icon makes, I really think some of these requests are out of hand. We do not need a race icon for every single skin color or eye color or class of the creature. The icons are supposed to be a representative image of a creature of that race, no matter if they're brown or green or a mage or a warrior or have spiky hair or a big nose or whatever. And some of the requests are outright silly. How can we make an icon of a race that's not represented anywhere graphically? The actually useful icon requests are being drowned in a huge pool of ones that don't make sense. --Varghedin (talk) 18:59, 15 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Specific examples? as for the death knights, I do believe we need them, because they are different from the normal state of their race. As for different colors for the same race, I think it's stupid.--Lon-ami (talk) 19:28, 15 December 2010 (UTC)


 * From the top, Hill giants are either creatures with no art (the ED type) or just a brown mountain giant. Incubus had no art at all, and their entire existence is speculative. Forsaken death knights have blue eyes instead of yellow, big deal. Chaos orc? Where are those seen? Faceless one caster? Ok so we need a seperate icon just because they wear a robe? Cho'gall disciples are ogres. Yes they have an X on their chest, but that won't show up on the icon anyway. Ravens already have an icon. Stormcrest eagles are eagles. Yeah, they're white. But they're eagles. That's like making a different icon for brunette and blonde humans. Etc etc etc. I could remove them myself but it would probably look like an exorsim with almost half the list gone. --Varghedin (talk) 19:54, 15 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Well, Hill giants "could" be included just because have icons for all the other giants, but well, not like they are any different...
 * I pretty much agree with you on everything, except on forsaken and troll death knights, because they're visually different, and not just "blue eyes", their skin is paler, too. I think they deserve an opportunity :S.--Lon-ami (talk) 21:20, 15 December 2010 (UTC)


 * I heavily agree with Varghedin, it's why I've been ignoring much of the list. But it seems an argument would start every time I removed a request... so I just started leaving things there to forever remain, cause I know I wasn't going to make them. I've tried to accommodate a few of the somewhat silly icon requests, but it has gotten out of hand.... why is there a request for ships, zeps, and subs? As far as I know, players don't physically control them as vehicles, and used on Vehicles by zone, which is why I've been making vehicle icons, specifically for that page. 23:18, 15 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Well i can tell some whys
 * Forsaken Deathknights shouldn't be a exception
 * Chaos orcs are in the dark portal in cataclysm
 * Ravens, Crocolisk, air lord and water lord are supposed to be made on the updated models from cataclysm
 * Cho'gal disciple i put it there because it was a new model and if someone made the human cultist model here(which is pretty much the same thing)they probably wouldn't mind making one about ogres(also didn't readd)
 * Faceless one caster was just the name we gave it, it's not about the robes, it's the huge mask and the different number of tentacles(which is a lame excuse and didn't readd it)
 * Stormcrest eagle i need for the alliance page because showing a white eagle as a brown icon looks wrong to me
 * Hill giant is the only one without a icon so that's why i added it
 * and removed things that didn't exist--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:44, 16 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Chaos orc at: http://www.wowhead.com/npc=42301#screenshots:id=192345 --Ashbear160 (talk) 02:11, 16 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Raven at: http://www.wowhead.com/npc=41651#. --Ashbear160 (talk) 15:28, 16 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Crocolisk at: http://www.wowhead.com/npc=44260#modelviewer--Ashbear160 (talk) 15:28, 16 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Tell me what you'll see from that croc you wouldn't see from . 22:18, 16 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes i kinda had doubts with the croc but since i putted everything else that was updated on the list might as well put that one, besides the texture on the new skins are much, much better, just go see it on wowhead the textures(also the new crocs have spiked and shells on the head)--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:34, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Lol the new crocs don't have those things on the chin, that the old ones have, there's a difference XD--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:35, 17 December 2010 (UTC)


 * The difference, if any, between chaos orcs and fel orcs has never been fully explained. Monster Guide even outright says that they are the same.-- 02:01, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Fine, can anybody check the name of the skin of these guys http://www.wowhead.com/npc=42301/horde-portal-sentry, and either write it here or on the list?--Ashbear160 (talk) 02:12, 17 December 2010 (UTC)


 * It is not a new skin either.-- 02:22, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Wowhead says they aren't(even trough they are) so i can't see the name of the skin...--Ashbear160 (talk) 02:27, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Because they're not under "Same model as"? Give me a break - Mor'ghor apparently doesn't share model either with his other ID's, despite the fact that he does look the same. -- 10:27, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I think it would be nice to have icons for boats/zeppelins, for the transportation and route pages.--Lon-ami (talk) 09:52, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I was talking because wowhead doesn't consider the same model i can't see the name of the skin... i know they are the same creature... --Ashbear160 (talk) 13:53, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * You can see the skin name using WoW Model Viewer. -- 14:02, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I know but i'm not going to download it...--Ashbear160 (talk) 15:27, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Updated the latest update list

 * I was bored hope it helps on what icon models are missing from cata--Ashbear160 (talk) 14:20, 6 January 2011 (UTC)


 * I also organized the request list by what i think it's order of importance--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:14, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

Ogres and Ogre mages
I think that, after the W3 problem with the number of heads and blue skin, we can "confirm" that 2 heads equals to ogre mages always, and that blue skin doesn't imply ogre magi. The deal now would be to make the default "ogre mage" icon direct to the pink version, instead of the blue one, leaving the blue versions as alternates, both of them, for its corresponding version by number of heads.

So, basically, we should move File:IconSmall_Ogre_Male2.gif to File:IconSmall_OgreMage.gif, File:IconSmall_OgreMage.gif to File:IconSmall_Ogre_Mage2.gif and File:IconSmall_Ogre_Mage2.gif to File:IconSmall_Ogre_Male2.gif.

Opinions?--Lon-ami (talk) 19:13, 22 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Or, even better:
 * :File:IconSmall_Ogre_Male2.gif to File:IconSmall_OgreMage.gif
 * File:IconSmall_OgreMage.gif to :File:IconSmall_OgreMage2.gif
 * :File:IconSmall_Ogre_Mage2.gif to File:IconSmall_Ogre2_Male.gif
 * That way the image names make more sense :).--Lon-ami (talk) 19:16, 22 February 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm pretty sure I've encountered several two-headed ogres that weren't mages. That said, the whole blue skin thing seems unecessary to me. Ogres comes in red, gray and black shades too. Why don't we just label them 2-headed ogres instead of labeling them by their class? --Varghedin (talk) 22:20, 22 February 2011 (UTC)


 * I think the name of their sub-race is Ogre Mage--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:20, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Two-headed ogres and ogre mages are not always the same thing.-- 03:23, 23 February 2011 (UTC)


 * The I suggest changing "ogre-mage" to "ogre-2-head", keeping my suggestion above. I'm with Varghedin, blue skin is unnecessary and confusing.--Lon-ami (talk) 16:59, 11 March 2011 (UTC)

Undead quillboar
Hmm vargedhin there was already a undead quillboar, in the undead section... i put it there as a alternate icon, hope you have no problems--Ashbear160 (talk) 17:46, 23 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Whoops, I looked under humanoids. No need to have duplicates; I removed it. --Varghedin (talk) 21:41, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

Kandooww's "modification" to the icons
So, some time ago, user Kandooww modified some icons, adding some sort of line above, to give more "icon" looks. I don't remember where, but I think we reached the decision that, with the small number of bits, we couldn't afford it.

But today, looking at some icons, I noticed it's still around. An example: File:IconSmall Wildhammer Male.gif. Look at both versions, and you'll see what I mean. So, should we revert all those pending editions or discuss the matter again? the new icons made for Cataclysm don't have those lines, so I think it's safe to revert everything to the originals.--Lon-ami (talk) 00:32, 6 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Discussion took place just a little above at . I just never went around and reverted them yet, was waiting on more comments, but then I forgot. 00:53, 6 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Well i don't like them brown is not a good colour--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:27, 6 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Personally, I don't like the line - it takes away more than 5 % of the icon's pixel space, and the aesthetic look it creates isn't even all that appealing to me. --Varghedin (talk) 18:11, 6 March 2011 (UTC)


 * Guess it's a yes for "revert them" :).--Lon-ami (talk) 20:38, 6 March 2011 (UTC)
 * I believe I got them all, if not go ahead and do a revert. Give it a little while though... the images need time to fix themselves. =) 04:07, 7 March 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't find any missing one. Great job ;).--Lon-ami (talk) 17:00, 11 March 2011 (UTC)

Names of some creatures

 * Hope i'm not a nuisance, but i put the term titanic guardian because 3 creatures with that model are called Titanic Guardian and i've never heard the name Pyramid watcher.
 * And the rock giant, have they ever been called that? if not i would like to suggest to change it to either mineral giant or gem giant since the name of the creatures with that model are directly referenced to that(Feldspar, Emerald and Opal).--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:38, 20 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Where are these 3 creatures you mention called Titanic Guardians? The Pyramid Watchers are located in southern Uldum at Neferset. Also, the rock giants are called mineral giants anywhere. Feldspar, Emerald and Opal are all types of rock (which is solid aggregate mineral). Besides, "mineral giant" sounds rather silly, don't you think? --Varghedin (talk) 00:55, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Ugh Titanic Guardians are the same Creature with a different hat(Green Hat), ow i just have to find the model for the purple hat..., and well mineral giats was a old idea that's why i suggested gem giants.--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:22, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Ok, Titanic Guardian is fine. Gem giant is better than mineral giant, but it still sounds strange to me. In WMV, they are called "Deepholm Golems". Although I think 'golem' is inappropriate, they could safely be called Deepholm Giants, for example. --Varghedin (talk) 08:42, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Changed it to Emerald colossus, since that's what they're called in . -- 08:43, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
 * The reason I didn't call them that was that the Opal Stonethrowers use the same model with a different color, indicating the color relates to the mineral rock they are made from (opal and emerald are quite distinct from each other, so the term "Emerald colossus" couldn't cover the "Opal colossus" type). In regards to their elemental nature, I do think it's right to be placing them there since they probably have their origin in Deepholm, which is a separate dimension from the Azerothian giants. I was unsure of where to put it but I chose giants since they have that creature type in-game.
 * How about a compromise - "Gemstone Colossus"? It removes the giant sub-type, keeps the colossus name from "Emerald Colossus", and broadens the type of mineral to include Opal and Feldspar, and it's closer to what Ashbear suggested as well --Varghedin (talk) 09:00, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Sounds fair to me. -- 09:34, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
 * That's cool--Ashbear160 (talk) 10:28, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Tigon Female
Varghedin you seem to have forgot to add the female tigon icon, just noting that--Ashbear160 (talk) 18:55, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

Scorpions
I noticed that most scorpions use a new model based on the korkhon anhiliator, should we change the korkhon anhilihator name to something like cataclysm scorpion or alternate scorpion, and what should be the name of the icons of the updated models of raven and crocolisks?--Ashbear160 (talk) 19:14, 23 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Since Scorpid is the older model and the newer model is called HordeScorpion, I just moved it to Scorpion to make it simple. 23:01, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Ah that works okay, although if the cata crocolisk and raven icons ever get named what should they be called?--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:11, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, like I said before.. there's no noticeable difference in an 18x18 pixel image of the two models for crocs. As for the raven... we'll see. 23:28, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
 * I already said there were differences old has a beard the new one doesn't. :P--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:32, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Right, I know that, but as I just said... there's no noticeable difference in an 18x18 pixel image. 23:42, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
 * I can see the Beard in the current icon that i wouldn't see if it used the new model in the same position :P--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:55, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Latest Update List
I updated the list with some new models of this patch, left the unfinished so it's not just 2 models on the list--Ashbear160 (talk) 18:49, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Please clarify the Big Cats Cub... are you talking about the Guardian Cub? 21:48, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
 * The 5 models after ragnaros in this page--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:00, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Ah them... how cute. Saber kitties. 23:08, 25 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes they are absolutely adorable.--Ashbear160 (talk) 01:42, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Silithid
I posted those 4 types of silithid creatures, because they are the only 4 that are missing their own icons from the list of silithid castes, and they have some sort of model(we can see it somewhat in the picture) the four are
 * Silithid queen
 * Silithid larva
 * Silithid pill bug
 * Silithid light
 * So yeah...--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:25, 19 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Those are objects, not creatures. When would you EVER use any of those icons? -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 21:26, 19 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Silithid caste list is one example, possible the only one, but there are also objects on this list.--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:29, 19 April 2011 (UTC)
 * So you want unique icons for objects that are non-interactable and would be used on exactly ONE page? I don't see the point. "Because it exists" is not, in and of itself, a good enough reason for making an icon. You need to demonstrate that it is needed and useful. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 21:36, 19 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Well there is a need of it for one page, and there are a few icons that are already on the list that only have use for one or two pages too.--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:47, 19 April 2011 (UTC)
 * If it is your fault, then you can stop it. If it is not your fault, and you are just emulating an existing 'standard', then try to think about it.-- 00:43, 20 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Not my fault, pretty sure vargheddin posted those icons (Cleaning machine, warning sign, Workbench) for a clear purpose in one page, but they are probably creature models, but not being creature models hasn't stopped people from making new icons(brooms, riverboat, goblin vault).
 * So i'm going to say that i'm requesting those icons to put them in the silithid caste list(one purpose), and they are creatures lorewise but not gameplaywise, and i do not see a problem with that.--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:51, 20 April 2011 (UTC)
 * All of those things you listed appear in WoW as creatures; i.e. you can select them, they have health, they have names, they have NPC IDs. These things don't have any of that. They're not even interactable objects. For all intents and purposes, they are TERRAIN FEATURES. Adding icons for them would be like making icons for pillars, rocks, or trees. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 00:56, 20 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Riverboat and brooms apply the same logic yet they are on the list, i guess the difference between our arguments is that your making gameplay arguments and i'm making lore arguments.--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:58, 20 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Slightly unrelated, brooms and riverboats are selectable NPCs. Why so many icons? Really.-- 02:57, 20 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Var makes icons for NPCs by zone articles, while I make icons for almost the same purpose but on the vehicles by zone article. That is why many objects icons exist. 03:08, 20 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Riverboat and brooms are actually selectable npcs.... i must have mistake them with those that are not selectable npcs, like i said i wanted the 4 silithid icons for the caste list, but if it's not within the "rules" it's not...--Ashbear160 (talk) 12:40, 20 April 2011 (UTC)
 * It is not a rule, it is just not a good idea. You are not even the one who will do the unnecessary work. Are you?-- 18:26, 20 April 2011 (UTC)
 * No, i tried but they said the quality wasn't good enough, i might try again trough--Ashbear160 (talk) 18:40, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

Children
What are these goblin and gilnean children? I've never seen any in-game that look different from normal goblins or human children. --Varghedin (talk) 19:07, 17 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Not sure how the Gilnean children look any different than any other human child, but I did notice they seem to have introduced goblin children... freaky looking things... about the size of normal goblins but with creepy faces... Only time I actually saw one was during Children's Week on a Horde Orphan. 20:00, 17 May 2011 (UTC)


 * The gilnean children just use different clothing than the human children, i usually just add to the latest update list things that appear as new model in that patch and then pass it to first list when the patch it's live--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:02, 17 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Different clothes don't warrant a picture. I'll look around for pics of goblin kids. --Varghedin (talk) 09:08, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

Stone giants
Should i ask for a second icon for stone giants with the trees?, it looks weird using this stone giant icon for the ones in grizzly hills.--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:27, 21 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Actually i just noticed that all stone giants (non-wood version)are named ones so i'll add them to the character list.--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:30, 21 June 2011 (UTC)
 * What stone giants don't have trees? Just use the stone giant or colossi icon. It is just their face. EDIT: Oh, you mean the other stone giants. They are unique now because there are no generic ones?-- 00:35, 21 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes that was decided on the talk page, if the model has only named mobs it can be repeated on the list on the list.
 * However should i request for a icon using the wood version or just use the mountain giant icon like the stone giant page uses?--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:41, 21 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I just noticed the same happened with fire giants only 4 named mobs.--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:49, 21 June 2011 (UTC)

Disappearances
Some icons seem to have disappeared after the problems with Curse, any idea, people? :S--Lon-ami (talk) 12:36, 26 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Seems to be a generalized problem, go here: Forum:Missing images.--Lon-ami (talk) 12:43, 26 June 2011 (UTC)

Mount icons
Should they continue to be on the list? it seems Vargheddin and Coobra doesn't want to do them, maybe because they kinda come with their own icons, Vargheddin, coobra will you eventually do any of the mounts-only models on the list, or you won't so i remove them, and looks less like a burden :(--Ashbear160 (talk) 14:19, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm not planning to do them, no. As I've said before, the larger the list is, the less likely I am to do any of them. --Varghedin (talk) 11:56, 29 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Ok fine then i'll take them out.--Ashbear160 (talk) 12:00, 29 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Removed.--Ashbear160 (talk) 12:03, 29 June 2011 (UTC)

Rage of the Firelands icons
Did you use the same icon of fandral for the druid of the flame male?--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:06, 29 June 2011 (UTC)
 * He said it was a temporary image. 22:48, 29 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh okay sorry then.--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:02, 29 June 2011 (UTC)

Another issue, are you going to make a firekin model? it would be usefull, since they share model with the Flamekin.--Ashbear160 (talk) 23:04, 29 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I don't know yet. Icons are kind of hard at the moment since WMV is broken right now and there aren't many screenshots to go by yet. I basically tackle the icons as I encounter them in-game for now. --Varghedin (talk) 07:36, 30 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh okay, they share model with most of the flamekin so you could use that too, in fact i'm going to change the name of that request--Ashbear160 (talk) 12:06, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

Molten giants
It seems all molten giants got an upgrade into a new model? what do we do?
 * My suggestion, is replace the image on the old icon with one of the new molten giants(so all molten giants in the wiki change to the new icon) ad the put the old icon in another file like with what he did to the old high elf icons--Ashbear160 (talk) 14:35, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Answers to Coobra

 * Dragcars, they were outdated i was thinking of removing them, i fixed their names and links anyway and left them in case someone might want to do them.
 * The only reason i requested the cinderweb egg and the firehawk egg is because varghedin, made a dragon egg icon so i was just applying the same standards, i however won't put it on the list, because i don't think dragon eggs are "creatures".
 * Owl Scouts appear in 4.2 both as named mobs, one is one of the hunting challenges, the other is Tyrande own owl scout, so i'll put this one is back on the list, and since they are unique i'll also add them to list of unique icons.--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:18, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Owl Scouts, give the mob name. 21:25, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Are you referring to Ban'thalos, a spirit beast in the form of an owl? He, if you read the description of owl scouts, is obviously not one. 21:29, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Dori'thur a green ghost owl(like owl scouts) that protects tyrande in wow added in 4.2 shares the same model/skin with ban'thalos, i also think the armoured fire elementals are the fire lords from warcraft 3(all ones carrying that model have the name or title of firelord)--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:37, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Can you tell me why is it not a Owl Scout? both share the same model, they have the same spells, one of them is a pet of tyrande (which her class is known to be related to owl scouts), and they both barely visible green ghost owls like owl scouts.
 * Can you at least tell me how it's not a owl scout?--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:43, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I'll drop the issue but at least i would like to know how it isn't a owl scout.--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:59, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Not sure why you keep calling Dori'thur green, when shes white, same with Ban'thalos. But lets go through the reasons, besides color, they're are not invisible, they are not invulnerable, and they attack (while the owl scouts do not). I'm just going by it's description and besides being an owl they have nothing in common. 00:20, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
 * They are both green, because they are spectral/transparent, it mixes with the background colours in the screenshots, but if you view with the view in 3d button in wowhead you'll see that they are green(because of the black background), i think the fact that owl scouts don't attack in warcraft 3 could be considered gameplay mechanics with a hint of lore, but let's just leave it, in a question in the cdev, thanks for answering.--Ashbear160 (talk) 00:46, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I don't go by how they look from wowhead's model view, I go by how they're actually seen in-game. And you're right Dori'thur does appear greenish when he flies out of the light, and white while flying in the light. However, Ban'thalos I have seen on dark background (a guildee raids with it) and it an annoying blueish white. 01:54, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
 * They both share the same skin(as far as i know) so them being different is impossible however the "white" is a excessively bright green light they emit from the tip of their wings, which makes i look whitish blue but if you see the trace after it dissipates a little you clearly see that it's green.--Ashbear160 (talk) 11:38, 14 July 2011 (UTC)

Justify icons
Since it was requested I point out a few icons for Ashbear to justify, here it goes: -- 21:22, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) Goblin Drag Car / Gnome Drag Car (both of which no longer have relevance, nor did they since release)
 * 2) Fire Noble
 * 3) Earth Noble
 * 4) Saronite Animus (a one time mob)
 * 5) Mur'ghoul (whose icon would just be another skin color of a murloc)
 * 6) Unholy Swords
 * 7) Unholy Axe
 * 8) Unholy Staff
 * 9) Ethereum Mace

--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:47, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) Goblin Drag Car / Gnome Drag Car - Removed, i just updated the link to a correct one and left them there in case someone wanted
 * 2) Fire Noble / Earth Noble - It's a new model that carry the name of lords, which is type of nobility, and have armour very similar to the air noble mob(in terms of complexity of bound armour, they even have floating armour on their head simulating crowns, the other name would be greater bound elemental but since all guys using this model carry the title of lord they might as well be nobles)which we already
 * 3) Saronite Animus - Intended to use them on the elemental page, in the same category as murmur and mercury elementals, once the icon was done.
 * 4) Mur'ghoul - To distinguish between undead and live murlocs(i think there at least two tribes of undead murlocs)
 * 5) Animated weaponry - the only icons missing in the Animated object article, but if you want we can reduce this to one icon like we did to the masks.
 * Except that the skin used by Mur'ghoul is the same skin often used by several murlocs throughout Azeroth. 21:50, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * It is? they have dead fish eyes :D, sorry about that then, removed.--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:00, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * A lot of murlocs lack irises and pupils. There are only one "air noble" and "earth noble" each, as far as I know.-- 22:24, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes removed that one, the fire nobles i'm refering is these guys Unstable pyrelord and others like him (ex flame archon) which share titles of nobility, notice the model changes with a pieces of floating armour simulating a crown(should be done like the air noble icon close up, so we can notice the crown) or the earth noble version(might me a lava noble trough), and earth noble Obsidian slaglord which share the backring with fire nobles, carry titles of nobility, but instead of a crown they have some sort of rooster crest on their heads(which a close-up like the air noble).
 * I'm also thinking of removing pet icon request like i did to mount icons except for celestial dragon which i need for a future article once it's made.
 * What do you think coobra? less clutter right?--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:36, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * So should i remove pets only? or not? except celestial dragon because i need it.--Ashbear160 (talk) 11:44, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, as we've seen in from previous pets becoming mobs (core hound pups, wyvern cubs, some others) icons might happen, but until they become more than just 1 companion I would say icons for them are not needed. 21:32, 14 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Ok I'll remove them all except the Celestial Dragon which i want to create a Celestial article(involving Algalon, Celestial Steed, Celestial Dragon), so i'll remove dark phoenix hatchling and guardian cub(trough they will remain in the latest update list)--Ashbear160 (talk) 21:38, 14 July 2011 (UTC)