Talk:Deathbringer Saurfang

Cleanup
Cleaned up a ton of speculation and discussion in the Strategy section. Much of it is wrong, and some of it is unhelpful. Original text moved to sections below.Jcgoodman (talk) 11:59, January 1, 2010 (UTC)

Blood Power calculus

 * The Blood Power gained from the very first mark cast follows a basic exponential function, attributing all subsequent power gained to this mark alone simplifies the model. The total number of Blood Power he gains is the integral of the function. Let people die and you shift the function to the right, but extend the range of the integral by 5%. Since it is an exponential function, the integral is also exponential, so area gained by extending the range is small compared to the area shoved off the right edge by shifting the curve right.

We can't assume that WowWiki players have taken calculus. The ideas here are interesting, but out of place. Maybe create a new [Saurfang Math] page?Jcgoodman (talk) 11:59, January 1, 2010 (UTC)

Blood Power on melee hit

 * Saurfang generates Blood Power when his melee hits connect

As far as I can tell this is wrong: Blood Power is gained by specials only.Jcgoodman (talk) 11:59, January 1, 2010 (UTC)

MOTFC damage depends on armor?

 * Mark of the Fallen Champion damage is based on Saurfang's melee swings and is affected by armor. However, it does not significantly increase as he gains Blood Power. (Using spell="Mark of the Fallen Champion" in the expression editor of Worldoflogs.com can verify that.)

This may or may not be correct, but it doesn't really affect the strategy.Jcgoodman (talk) 11:59, January 1, 2010 (UTC)

Blood Beast control

 * Blood Beasts are immune to snares, roots, and stuns, and other methods of slowing and kiting (such as frost traps and a shadow priest's Mind Flay)

This is not true.Jcgoodman (talk) 11:59, January 1, 2010 (UTC)

Blood Power makes him hit harder?

 * His melee damage is not high compared to Trial of the Crusader bosses, though it becomes harder as he gains Blood Power. Even with 100 Blood Power, his damage is not high enough to cause serious problems for a Tier 9-geared tank. After his Blood Power reaches 100, Saurfang casts Mark of the Fallen Champion on a random raid member and his Blood Power resets to zero, so he never has more than a 100% damage buff.

As far as I can tell from my combat logs, Blood Power does not amplify his damage. I see hits on tank for 7369 with 0 blood power and 7564 with 90+ blood power. Jcgoodman (talk) 11:59, January 1, 2010 (UTC)

Blood Nova description
I can't find anything that indicates that Blood Nova is only cast on players afflicted by Boiling Blood. The ability text merely says it is cast on a random player, and none of the discussion elsewhere online leads me to believe this is true. Botono (talk) 05:32, February 3, 2010 (UTC)

I have never seen Blood Nova cast on someone who didn't already have Boiling Blood. It should be pretty easy to prove it if this isn't true: you'd see Blood Nova cast on someone without Boiling Blood, which has never happened in any raid I've been in. I think this is a case of self-reinforcement; the fact that no sites have it listed isn't proof at all. Illuminatedwax (talk) 06:09, February 3, 2010 (UTC)

I have confirmed that Blood Nova is cast on random members of the raid, regardless of Boiling Blood. I ran an addon which checked if a user had Boiling Blood when they were hit with Blood Nova (the initial cast, not the secondary hits to players near by). In a single attempt, it was cast on 12 people who did not have Boiling Blood. Botono (talk) 12:08, February 7, 2010 (UTC)

As an addendum to the comment above, I was personally hit with Blood Nova and I did not have Boiling Blood and I was not within range of any other player. Botono (talk) 12:19, February 7, 2010 (UTC)

As skeptical as I was, I didn't know about the existence of World of Logs. Any look through any Saurfang fight will tell you I was wrong. Illuminatedwax (talk) 18:18, February 7, 2010 (UTC)

Orc?
How does the achivement suggest it's an Orc? If anything, it suggests that he has garrote. BobNamataki (talk) 12:34, November 7, 2009 (UTC)


 * Look at Category:WoW Icons: Achievement Boss. The newly added icons are all clearly identified by their name, except the last File:Achievement Boss Saurfang.png, which would be The Deathbringer's icon.
 * 14:30, November 7, 2009 (UTC)

From the Fingers of Blizzard to Our Eyes
I think this basically confirms who the Deathbringer is supposed to be. http://blue.mmo-champion.com/13/21035174537-icecrown-citadel-testing--november-1014.html --Joshmaul (talk) 18:48, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

Image
That image has "By Marla" Written in the centre. BobNamataki (talk) 12:30, November 22, 2009 (UTC)

Horde
Is it possible that they won't bury him and he'll work with the horde kinda like koltira deathweaver? Hallowseve15 (talk) 13:11, November 23, 2009 (UTC)


 * I don't think so. He was raised by the Lich King and killed again. I don't believe Varok would like to see his son undead, even if he was to serve the Horde.
 * 17:13, November 23, 2009 (UTC)

Enrage
There is a post on the tankspot forums and I have recently seen the same that there is a hard enrage (a buff giving him +500% damage as well as other effects) at 8 minutes into the fight. Perhaps this should be added to the general page?

Inevitable? I think not.
The article claims that he will eventually fill up his Blood power bar. This is false, as my raid managed to down him at 87 Blood power, before the first Mark. The key is perfection in dealing with the adds and the nova. Having tanks with 60%+ (before Chill) evasion was also very helpful. Coolcoder (talk) 00:37, December 17, 2009 (UTC)

Power Word: Shield and Blood Power
Is there a source on Power Word: Shield not preventing the blood power gain? I can't find any blue posts about it. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 05:55, January 13, 2010 (UTC)

I've searched and have found nothing to substantiate this. We killed Saurfang on 10 man tonight, and afterwards I dove into the combat log. If PW:S does prevent Blood Power generation, I can account for 99 out of 100 Blood Power before he starts to cast the first Mark. If PW:S does not prevent Blood Power generation, he would have gained at least 114 Blood Power before casting the first Mark. The plural of anecdote is not data, but it looks to me like this remark is simply wrong. --Layana (talk) 23:56, January 13, 2010 (UTC)


 * Would a minimum damage threshold to qualify for one point of Blood Power account for the minor discrepency. Lag could as well, I suppose. Rei-gouki (talk) 07:22, January 27, 2010 (UTC)
 * Seeing as this is still listed as an undocumented change on the 3.3.2 changes, and no public research has disproven it as of yet, i've made the changes to this page to match the change. It should be removed from both if disproven.
 * In personal experience, i haven't taken a close look at logs, but the blood power generation rate certainly went down with the patch, but that may have just been the hotfix that came shortly after. -- 17:33, February 28, 2010 (UTC)

DI and Mark of the Fallen champ?
If a a Paladin has Mark of the Fallen Champ, and uses DI on someone else, does Saurfang get healed? Tanooki1432 (talk) 10:01 Febuary 22, 2010
 * The paladin still dies with the Mark, so while I haven't tried it it's almost certainly a yes. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 18:05, February 22, 2010 (UTC)

Heroic Difficulty?
I noticed that the heroic difficulty section of the article states that the major difference between normal and heroic is the increased blood power gain and the new ability cast by the blood beasts. Hilariously enough it ignores the biggest difference being all damage in the fight is increased by 1% for every 1 Blood Power Saurfang has. This has a huge impact on the difficulty on the fight, when 2 healing Saurfang and the damage from upwards of 70+ BP becomes incredibly stressful. The difference is actually such that healing 2 marks at 80% blood power is more difficult than healing 3 marks at 40% blood power, and I'm practically begging Saurfang to quickly cast another Mark before someone dies. It might be worth stressing in the article. Furinaux (talk) 00:35, June 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Doesn't he gain 1% damage per point of blood power on normal mode too? -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 05:30, June 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * No..... Does anyone who designs the boss fight article pages even pay attention during the fight? I find it amazing that people debate things like Blood Nova only hitting Blood Boil targets with "absolute certainty" when it very obviously is completely and utterly random.Furinaux (talk) 09:13, June 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * According to the spell link on Wowhead, yes he does. My own experiences back this up as well. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 16:38, June 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, because everyone knows that all the websites certainly do not copy information off of each other and definitely have never posted widely accepted false information such as Anetheron's sleep is counterable by a tremor totem. Obviously your experience is unreliable. His damage never increases on normal, just as a previous commenter on this very discussion board has claimed. On normal mode he never gains the Blood Power buff, whereas on heroic he does gain the Blood Power buff. Which is hilarious because you'd think a DPS would see that buff. Furinaux (talk) 20:03, June 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * Just for completeness, this is what I've noticed after rechecking my information. Saurfang will grow 1% larger per 1 point of BP no matter the difficulty, normal or heroic. Saurfang only gains 1% additional damage in conjunction with the size factor on heroic mode only. This can be confirmed as Saurfang's damage definitely remains constant on normal mode and, again, he doesn't actually have the Blood Power buff as normally shown on heroic versions. The fact that he still increases in size probably caused all the confusion. Conclusively, it again very much worth noting the incredible amounts of incoming damage on heroic modes. BoP'ing players at this time is very useful in keeping healing manageable until Saurfang pushes over and casts another Mark, resetting his damage. Feel free to double check. Furinaux (talk) 05:29, July 2, 2010 (UTC)